Dáil Éireann debate -
Tuesday, 2 Jul 2024

I propose to take Questions Nos. 1 to 6, inclusive, together. The Cabinet committee on Government co-ordination generally meets in advance of Government meetings and its next meeting is scheduled for 8 July 2024. I am a member of the committee, with the Tánaiste and the leader of the Green Party. The Secretary General to the Government, my chiefs of staff and chiefs of staff for the Tánaiste and the leader of the Green Party also sit in on meetings. The committee reviews the agenda of Government meetings, discusses political priorities and reviews the activity of Cabinet committees.

I raise an issue with the Taoiseach about which he has received correspondence from the alliance supporting nursing homes. It wrote to the Taoiseach on 21 June 2024 regarding the national vetting service which, I believe, crosses Departments. I imagine that as it is dealt with under the National Vetting Bureau (Children and Vulnerable Persons) Act 2012, it has implications across Government with regard to the vetting of people who work with children and vulnerable persons.

The issue raised by the alliance with the Taoiseach in the letter - it has not received anything but the briefest of acknowledgement - is the fact that its organisation, which represents smaller family-run and independent nursing homes, are required to vet their staff. Under the legislation, once one is deemed to be an "relevant organisation" which works in that area, one should receive access to a portal for the National Vetting Bureau where one vets one's staff. It appears that this organisation, the alliance, is being denied that right because it is being monopolised by Nursing Homes Ireland, which represents bigger, sometimes international, operations in the nursing homes sector that receive the vetting from the National Vetting Bureau for nothing, as it is done with public money. Nursing Homes Ireland is charging its members €10 per vetting of people and charging €25 to people who are not members of its organisation. In other words, this organisation is making money out of a publicly-provided vetting service and is excluding others from being able to get the vetting which they should be able to get under the legislation. The alliance describes this as a scandal and as profiteering off the back of public money. They want to know why this is happening because they say that it flies in the face of the legislation. I ask the Taoiseach, therefore, to get back to this organisation.

I thank the Leas-Cheann Comhairle. I want to show the Taoiseach some pictures and I can send them to him. I have a picture here of a series of staples and nails and similarly in this photograph. This is meant to be a picture of the cremated remains of an individual, a guy called Johnny Fox. There are quite a number of staples, nails and screws in his cremated remains. Johnny Fox was the first coach of Rhasidat Adeleke, was the founder of Darkness into Light and he died in April. When his family opened his urn to spread the ashes, they discovered this series of staples and nails in his remains. It was obviously extremely upsetting. I was in touch with his son, Seán, who has said that he cannot grieve because of his trying to get to the bottom of how this could have happened and of how disrespectful it was to their father.

Thus far, the only response they have received from the Dublin Cemeteries Trust is an instruction to waive the cremation costs for the family, which really is not good enough. The family want to get to the bottom of how this could have possibly happened and to ensure that it is not happening to any other family. There does not appear to be any independent regulator to ensure that cremations are being carried out properly and that external items are not remaining in people's urns. The family is also hoping to have a meeting with the Taoiseach, if possible.

After a revolt by disabled people forced the Government to scrap the hated Green Paper, the Taoiseach pledged to meet disabled persons organisations to discuss an alternative.

On 8 May, the Taoiseach told me that, as Taoiseach, he intended to meet directly with disability groups and that he would be issuing invitations to engage more substantially with them. Having waited six weeks from the time of that commitment, 11 disabled persons organisations wrote to the Taoiseach about this on 18 June. Two weeks on, they have yet to receive a single reply and not even an acknowledgement. Cír Doyle of Neuro Pride Ireland told me that they feel that to be both insulting and disrespectful. I acknowledge that the Taoiseach has met Inclusion Ireland but I am talking about disabled persons organisations here. They want to know what is the story, why the delay and when will he meet them.

I also want to remind the Taoiseach of the situation at St. Killian’s Special School, Mayfield, Cork. Children here continue go without proper assistance from any team of therapists. The school has sourced a team of suitable therapists but the State continues to fail to deliver on the promise of funding to put such an arrangement in place. When will the Taoiseach get this issue sorted?

There is an urgent need for co-ordination on school transport. It is particularly sparse in rural areas and is very limited. A group of parents got together in my constituency to campaign for the introduction of a bus between Bantry and Schull Community College and there are about 35 pupils who need it. Bus Éireann has told me that the children are already covered under the concessionary scheme but there is no direct bus from Bantry to Schull for them to pay a concessionary fare on top of that. There is a clear level of demand there. Great work in recent years has been done on local links and that approach needs to be taken with regard to school buses. I ask for the provision of a school bus service between Bantry and Schull to be considered.

Today, a Canadian tourist who was attacked on O'Connell Street last week has died in hospital. Neno Dolmajian from Montreal was 41 years old. It is a very sad, tragic and heartbreaking occasion for his family and friends and our deepest sympathies go out to his family. It points to a very serious issue that the main street of our capital city is a dangerous and violent place on a regular basis for many people. It is not just the main street of our capital city but people do not feel safe in towns and villages across the country. It is not happening by accident. It is happening because we have the lowest number of gardaí per capita for the past six years, because our prisons are so full that the Minister for Justice has to choose prisoners for early release to make way for new prisoners and because an enormous number of unduly lenient prison sentences are being given at present. It is also because we still have Garda recruitment on the floor with gardaí still being attacked on a daily basis. We also have gardaí leaving because of retirement and they are resigning in larger numbers. I do not believe that this Government has got to the bottom of ensuring that we have a Garda force that is strong enough to be able to keep our towns, cities and the main street of our capital safe.

I do not know whether the issue of support for Mrs. von der Leyen to have another term of office leading the European Commission came up at the Taoiseach's Cabinet committee on Government co-ordination. The Taoiseach might advise us whether it did. I find it absolutely extraordinary that a Government that professes to be serious about Palestinian rights would weigh in behind von der Leyen for a second term. His explanation earlier notwithstanding, it is scandalous and certainly does not represent the sentiment of Irish people, or people internationally for that matter, who increasingly recognise that Israeli impunity must end, that Israel must be held to account and that leaders who are absolutely determined and serious on that point are needed. I ask him to clarify to the House whether he has raised the issue of Israel with von der Leyen. Has he raised that subject? Has he confronted her outrageous behaviour in standing shoulder to shoulder with Israel and with a deranged Israeli Government that is hell bent on the destruction of Palestinian lives? Can he give us that clarity? Did he have that conversation and what was the nature of that conversation? What did the Taoiseach say to her and how did she respond?

I wish to raise the issue of the co-ordination of Ukrainian refugees in County Clare. For the last 18 months, 21 refugees have been located in Loop Head. Loop Head, by the admission of Clare County Council, is a community in terminal population decline. It has seen 21 individuals being integrated into that very peripheral community, six of whom are children in school and four are pensioners. There are 11 others, of whom two have work. Others are studying English lessons in Kilrush. All involved are deeply upset by the letter of notice they received. The owner of the bed and breakfast accommodation has invested a huge amount of money to ensure the building is compliant. We have also seen the same situation unfold in Shannon. The key criticisms are the communication methods, the lack of notice and the information as to where they are being relocated. There is another point, in that they are being relocated into communities such as Lisdoonvarna in north Clare, which has already seen its population increase exponentially; it has tripled in the past 18 months. There are concerns coming from north Clare but then there are also concerns coming from Loop Head. Loop Head wants to keep these people there. They have been a huge positive attribute to the community, which has seen a lot of funding coming their way.

I am going to bring up my yearly issue of the brown water in Dundalk. It is not the first time I have brought it up with the Taoiseach. It is a particular issue of increased manganese in the water supply reacting with chlorine, which leads to the water being incredibly brown. It also means this impacts on any repairs that get fixed or any flushing teams operating in other areas. Following my own interaction with the Taoiseach, I had a decent enough interaction with Irish Water at a high enough level. I have been informed there is a pilot scheme currently going into place at Cavanhill treatment plant to remove the manganese. If this pilot scheme works - and we will know by the end of the summer if it does - all works can then be completed by 2026. If it does not work, there is definitely a workable solution but that will take until 2028 to be completed. I wish to make sure that the Government will provide the resources to ensure we get this done as quickly as possible. This has been an ongoing issue and it is not good enough for the people of Dundalk. While there may be other issues around water pressure and old infrastructure, this is a vital issue which needs to be dealt with. I welcome the works that have been done. We just need to make sure the resources are there to make sure it happens as quickly as possible.

I will do my very best. It seems the question about when the Government co-ordination committee meets is just a jumping-off point. I will do my best to answer a variety of important questions.

First, as to Deputy Boyd Barrett's question, I will certainly ensure there is a response issued to that organisation which has written to me on behalf of family-owned nursing homes around the national vetting scheme, the portal and a number of other issues it raised. We have obviously acknowledged it. It is out for views on it to relevant Departments and I will get back to that organisation. I thank it for its correspondence.

As for Deputy Murphy's question, I can only sympathise with the family and friends of Johnny Fox. I can only imagine how proud he must have been of Rhasidat Adeleke, who is doing our country so incredibly proud. We are all excited to see what she is going to do in Paris. The Deputy has just outlined an incredibly traumatic situation to the Dáil. It is one on which I am not suitably qualified to comment right now but I will see what advice I can give to the family via the Deputy in this regard. I can only imagine how absolutely upsetting it must have been. I will make some inquiries and revert to the Deputy.

I say to Deputy Barry that I am absolutely determined to meet disability organisations. I have, as the Deputy acknowledged in his own statement, begun those meetings with a variety of representative groups. I am very happy to engage with the 11 organisation which have written to me. While I do not say this rudely, two weeks is not an unreasonable time for me to be able to get back to people, schedule things and the like. I absolutely intend to meet them. Indeed, I will be chairing a Cabinet committee on disability again this Thursday. I am eager to continue to meet organisations and I will do that. I will also follow up for the Deputy in relation to St. Killian's Special School, Mayfield, County Cork, on the issue he raised about therapy supports, the progress the school has made and the frustration it is finding in getting that loop closed.

I thank Deputy Cairns for her fair point about the need for a co-ordinated approach across Government on the issue of school transport. The Deputy rightly mentioned the progress that can be made with Local Link. It is even more frustrating for parents and school communities when they see how certain things can be done outside the school transport system. While I could point to the big reform planned on school transport, some of which is starting on a pilot basis this September, the Deputy has raised a particular issue of school transport from Bantry to Schull Community College. I will specifically raise this issue with both Bus Éireann and the Minister for Education, Deputy Foley, and ask they come back to Deputy Cairns on the matter.

I join with Deputy Tóibín in expressing my absolute sympathy to the family and friends of the Canadian tourist who has just passed. I obviously have been in the Dáil since that news broke. It is a heartbreaking situation. Out of respect to the family, I do not wish to conflate it with broader issues around safety and Garda numbers, but I can, of course, point to progress we are making on Garda recruitment and training. However, for the here and now, that is an extraordinarily devastating situation for the family affected.

As for Deputy McDonald's question, while I am not sure if the issue was raised at the co-ordination meeting, I have of course spoken to my coalition colleagues in relation to President von der Leyen. The Deputy and I have a different view on this, clearly. I respect that fact. I point out to Deputy McDonald that at the European Council, people across the political spectrum, including socialist prime ministers and presidents, backed the re-nomination of President von der Leyen. She was also the lead candidate for a political grouping in the European election that won the most seats in the European Parliament. It is important there is correlation between the votes of people.

I raised the Middle East on a number of occasions with President von der Leyen. I spoke to her again over the weekend specifically on funding for the Palestinian Authority. Fundamentally, President Von der Leyen's view gets misrepresented. She is in favour of an immediate ceasefire, she has increased humanitarian aid, she believes in a two-state solution, she believes-----

I respectfully disagree with Deputy McDonald on that. I will continue my work in speaking up for the Palestinian people. They, their President and their ambassador to Ireland know that.

Deputy Wynne raised the Ukrainian refugee situation at Loop Head and the relocation of those refugees. I will ask the Minister, Deputy O'Gorman, to come back to the Deputy on this issue. The Deputy has specifically outlined a number of challenges in County Clare that deserve consideration from the Department.

As to the brown water issue in Dundalk, which Deputy Ó Murchú has raised with me on a number of occasions, I am pleased the meeting with Irish Water went well. I will certainly work with him as Head of Government to make sure any resources required are in place.

I propose to take Questions Nos. 7 to 15, inclusive, together.

The National Economic and Social Council, NESC, advises me on strategic policy issues relating to sustainable economic, social and environmental development in Ireland. NESC is currently working in four main areas. Throughout 2023, NESC engaged in a programme of activities to mark its establishment in 1973.

This is an opportunity to look forward and to consider how the council can continue to find solutions to complex and challenging economic, social and environmental issues. The council will publish a book, NESC@50: Ireland at a Pivotal Moment, to mark the anniversary. The book will capture the voices and ideas of more than 40 people who participated in a major conference at Dublin Castle in November 2023. It is expected that the book will be published in early autumn.

The second area of focus is what NESC describes as "better work". The programme for Government outlines the need for a concerted policy focus on increasing the number of quality and sustainable jobs in the labour market, and the Government has introduced a series of measures designed to improve employees’ terms and conditions. The council’s work in this area focuses on evidence of the benefits for employees, employers, the wider economy more generally and social cohesion. It also examines potential cost implications for enterprises in the private sector and for our public services. It is expected that the report will be published in quarter 3 of this year.

The third area being worked on is housing. NESC is currently examining options that will help better realise affordable, integrated, and sustainable residential development. This includes considering emerging systems thinking within housing research, as well as a particular focus on the practicality of active land management and the advantages and challenges associated with modern methods of construction. It is expected that NESC will publish this work also in quarter 3 of this year.

The final area NESC is working on is energy, just transition and shared island. In the Government, we are working hard to ensure that Ireland captures the full potential associated with cleaner energy. Work by NESC will support us by considering the changes needed to eliminate fossil fuel use from Ireland and to meet our climate objectives. It will examine economic, trade, and enterprise opportunities and challenges associated with large-scale investment in clean energy infrastructure and what the transition means for households and communities, including the impact on energy poverty. It will help to inform and shape Ireland’s overall strategy and narrative for the transformation of the whole energy system on the island of Ireland. Work on this programme will be ongoing throughout the rest of 2024.

Skin cancer is the most common form of cancer in Ireland. Some 10,000 people per annum are diagnosed with skin cancer. Despite this, the use of sunbeds is still widespread. Using a sunbed increases the risk of developing skin cancer by 60%. That is only after just one session on a sunbed. More worryingly, 40% of people continue to use sunbeds despite knowing the risks involved for developing skin cancer. We need to do something about this. Australia has banned outright use of sunbeds and it is having an impact on health outcomes and costs to the state. I ask the Taoiseach to consider an outright ban on the use of sunbeds in Ireland because it will save money, but most importantly, it will save lives.

Councillor Pearse McGeough and I met representatives of Connect Credit Union in Blackrock this morning regarding the planned closure of the Kilsaran and Clogherhead branches on 30 August. This is not something we want to see. I spoke to the representatives and our biggest concern was about the vulnerable clients and that thing that makes the credit union different. We need to make sure that full supports are being provided and I have been told that they will be in this case. It is an issue which needs to be revisited. We all know the issue in relation to rural Ireland and the loss of services. The credit union brought up the report by the International Credit Union Regulators Network, ICURN, - the report of the auditor of auditors - and the fact that consideration was given to changing the threshold which at present means that credit unions can only have 10% of mortgages, business loans and agri-loans. Credit unions across the board will state that they need the threshold to be increased in order that they can do more businesses and provide services to people. That is vital, particularly when we consider the housing crisis.

The US medical devices company Stryker employs 1,500 people in Carrigtwohill, County Cork. A significant minority of this workforce has chosen to join the trade union SIPTU. The company refused to recognise the union, in contrast to the position at its other plants in Macroom and Limerick, where it purchased companies with pre-existing union recognition arrangements. Stryker states that it is adhering to Irish law, but union members in Carrigtwohill believe the company is hiding behind it. SIPTU took the issue to the national contact point, NCP, for the OECD guidelines for multinational enterprises on responsible business conduct. The NCP ruled on 3 May that Stryker should be prepared to engage in collective bargaining with worker representatives and that Stryker should consider how pre-existing collective bargaining arrangements at two other Irish facilities acquired by the company can be replicated so as its entire Irish workforce has the same representational arrangements in place. Will the Taoiseach encourage this company to observe and implement the recommendations from this important OECD body?

It is obvious that the Taoiseach is running away from a debate on the report by the Housing Commission, which we have been asking about for weeks. One of the major contributors to the report was the NESC. It gave a presentation to the commission in March 2023, which referred to the need to engineer permanent affordability into housing policy. NESC referred to the housing policy as dysfunctional and said that an emergency response was required. It also said that we needed the active managing of land for the public good. This morning, the Taoiseach refused a debate on the report of the Housing Commission before the recess and at the same time, we got an announcement that the Taoiseach has signed a legal order which will waive the requirement for social and affordable housing on a site like the one on Aungier Street, which is in public ownership. This repeats the ongoing policy of the Government, handing over land or responsibility for dealing with housing crisis to the market and to private for-profit interests. When is the Government going to change tack and at least debate the issues about the report of the Housing Commission?

It has now been two years since the Government received the report into the scale of defects in apartments and duplexes, revealing that a majority of the properties built between 1991 and 2013 were likely affected. There may be up to 100,000 apartments and duplexes whose owners face an average cost, which is probably increased since, of €25,000 to repair. It has been a year and a half since the Government announced that there would be a 100% redress scheme, with retrospection. It has been a similar amount of time, about 16 months, since the Government announced that there would be an interim scheme for emergency fire safety measures. The scheme has opened and almost 300 individual applications have been made for different apartment blocks and multi-unit developments, representing almost 16,000 residential units. However, still not a single cent has been paid out in terms of interim funding emergency fire safety measures. There appear to be significant delays. We still do not have the legislation in terms of heads of Bill or in terms of the overall scheme. It is very unlikely at this stage that we will get that before the next general election. This means that all we and these homeowners have is a promise, which is not good enough. We need to have action.

Clean drinking water and wastewater treatment systems are basic components needed to grow or even to just sustain rural communities. At the moment, our island communities in west Cork face huge barriers in accessing affordable social housing due to the need for a stand-alone wastewater treatment units. In Castletownbere, there is an issue where there is no extra capacity for drinking water because of the presence of pearl mussels in the current supply of drinking water. There is also the issue I raised with the Taoiseach the week before last about Shannonvale, where the wastewater treatment plant literally spills into the green space in the village and into the river. An estate on the other side of the river was built in 2004 with a temporary sewer because the village was supposed to get one installed in 2005. Twenty years later, it has still not been resolved or taken in charge. That is now degrading and adding to the leakage into the same river. I have had extensive meetings with Irish Water on a regular basis. I am sick of meeting them and I think they are sick of meeting me. As it does not have enough capital funding, it is prioritising areas that have no treatment systems, where the waste is going straight into the water. It desperately needs more money.

The EU directive on adequate minimum wages is a significant opportunity to improve workers' rights and increase productivity in the Irish economy. The success of the directive relies on the domestic legislation underpinning it and the plan on collective bargaining that will be presented to European Commission as part of its transposition. The need for collective bargaining to be protected by legislation has never been greater. We have seen a race to the bottom for terms and conditions for workers and an increase in low-paid work and the marginalisation of trade unions and workplace democracy.

Workers' rights must be given priority and firm legal protections enacted. We fully support the trade union movement and its campaign on the right to organise. Does the Government support those objectives? It is only through collective bargaining that we can ensure that Ireland addresses the productivity difficulties that persist across the economy. Adopting both of these approaches can ensure good jobs, decent work and delivering a strong economy that addresses the causes of low pay and poor working conditions at source.

I will start with that issue. The short answer on that is that I agree. I met with ICTU last week at the Labour Employer Economic Forum. It is not for me to speak for the unions but it is fair to say this was a very pressing issue for them. They are right to be. It is important that when unions are good enough to come to the table, some of the issues they highlight as a priority do get that sense of priority from the forum too. I have asked for intensive engagement between them and the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment and the Minister, Deputy Burke specifically on making progress for the next meeting of the LEEF. Now that the Deputy has raised it with me, I am happy to write to her on this.

I share the view on collective bargaining. It is very important in these times when vulnerable people, low-paid workers or others can seek to be exploited by those who seek to bring division that the trade union movement has a more important role than ever in helping to deliver standards in the way they do and on which they have a proud record. On this I agree with the Deputy. We are committed to transposing the EU directive and I will write to her with further details on that.

Deputy O’Sullivan raised skin cancer and the danger of sun beds; I agree. It is a statement of fact that they are dangerous. The evidence on skin cancer is pretty categoric. Going back to my memory from my time as Minister for Health, measures were taken relating to banning them for children and so on but that is nowhere near adequate in terms of where we need to get to. I will seek the view of the Minister for Health whose policy responsibility it is but I am certainly in support of taking more action here on advancing our national cancer strategy’s objectives and keeping our population healthy from a cancer perspective.

On Deputy Ó Murchú’s question, I meeting the credit union movement at 4.30 p.m. and will raise the issue he raised with me. I did not catch the name of the first credit union because there was noise. It is Clogherhead-----

I will raise that and particularly the issues it raised with the Deputy about some of the changes it needs. I am happy to revert in writing.

On Deputy Barry’s question, yes, I would encourage a company to take seriously the recommendations and findings of an OECD body and a national contact point as well. I will make inquiries with the Department of Enterprise, Trade and Employment on the issue regarding the company that he highlighted.

On Deputy Boyd Barrett’s issue, I do not want to repeat points I made here earlier but the land for the DIT buildings was always land that was in the ownership of DIT rather than in the direct ownership of the Government. Legislation was passed in this House, the Grangegorman Development Agency Act 2005, under which it was understood that the purpose of the disposal of that land was to fund the work at Grangegorman. The Land Development Agency confirmed in writing that it had no wish to acquire that site.

-----because the Government’s intention was always to allow for every cent of funding to go into the health clinic in the west quad, including a number of new schools in TU Dublin. That is separate and distinct to the work we are doing with many other public sites and the extra capital that we put into the Land Development Agency. The Deputy has a different view from me on whether the Land Development Agency should even exist.

I would also point out that the decision has only been made in relation to not transferring to the Land Development Agency. What actually happens with the site in terms of ownership and the provision of housing, should it be housing, and the composition of that is a matter for further planning applications and so on. There has been a jump and a presumption that either there will be no social and affordable housing. That is not the same as saying that a site will not be transferred to the Land Development Agency.

That is okay too. I am not saying that there cannot be future housing development on that site and as part of a planning permission for that site that cannot involve social and affordable housing. They are genuinely different points.

Deputy Murphy raised the apartment and duplex defects scheme. I need to get him a note on that because I do not have the information to hand. My understanding is there was a meeting between the Minister, Deputy O’Brien, and the LGMA in recent weeks on the issue of interim funding and what can be done with the applications that are in. I do not have access to the information here but I will come back to the Deputy in writing.

Deputy Cairns is right. I can tell her that if one has meetings and engagements with Irish Water, and she points out she has had many of them, there is a need to look at the capital funding available to Irish Water. There is a number of significant pinch points in terms of basic infrastructure in Ireland, particularly around water, energy and housing. The Government will have a number of opportunities to see if we can do more on that in and around the budgetary process. I am happy to consider what more can be done to help Irish Water advance capital projects.

I propose to take Questions Nos. 16 to 18, inclusive, together.

I was delighted to host the child poverty and well-being summit on Thursday, 23 May in Dublin Castle.

I welcomed the former UK Prime Minister and Chancellor, Gordon Brown, who shared what he had learned from his experience of reducing child poverty rates in the UK in his keynote address. My colleague the Minister for Children, Equality, Disability, Integration and Youth, Deputy O’Gorman, also gave a keynote address.

Children’s participation was an important feature of the day. In advance of the summit, a youth advisory group on child poverty and well-being was established. I wanted to hear directly from young people living in Ireland about what is important to them. An important output from the youth advisory group was a video that was shown at the summit, which highlighted the key issues that matter to them.

While it is important to consult with children and young people, it is also essential to have accountability and to show how we have taken their views on board. That is why I have committed to following up with the youth advisory group again later this year.

Children’s participation also included an art exhibition and a specially written musical performance from Music Generation. It was a pleasure to see the artistic contributions from children and young people and it was a highlight of my day to meet many of the children and young people at the summit. The summit itself had three objectives: to increase the focus on child poverty and well-being across government and its agencies, to take stock of progress and learning to date and to inform future considerations. To further that end, policymakers from across the public service were in attendance as well as representatives from the non-government sector and research organisations.

A panel discussion took place in the morning and 17 innovative case clinics took place in the afternoon. Each case clinic engaged the collective experience of the group to discuss a challenge or new idea that will help address child poverty or well-being. Case clinic topics were wide ranging and included preventing family homelessness, maximising the impact of social welfare payments, and improving educational outcomes for migrant children.

Discussions from the summit will inform cross-government dialogue in advance of budget 2025 as the Government seeks to support and deepen the focus on child poverty and well-being. A summary report on the summit will be published by the child poverty and well-being programme office in due course.

I thank the Taoiseach for his response. I have discussed this matter with the Taoiseach and other members of the Government in the recent past. I am always pleased to hear he is cognisant that listening to children is extremely important but figuring out how to turn that into policy is just as important and, therefore, it is encouraging to hear that, and what the Government does in the forthcoming budget will be crucial to improving childhood poverty rates.

One area I will focus on is the school meals programme, which is important. Year after year, academic report after international example, we brought it in and I believe it has been extremely successful. However, I am concerned to hear there has been pushback where some schools in certain parts of the country do not wish to bring it in. Perhaps they consider it is too much of a burden. I am not sure. However, it is important that, as Head of the Government, the Taoiseach looks at this because it is an important aid to access to education and also to support children who are on the lowest rung when it comes to eating standards.

The lack of planning in the school system means that children with additional educational needs are consistently being failed. I am contacted by parents across west Cork every week. I was speaking to a mother and her twin children recently. One of the twins has Down's syndrome and they have been in the same class all the way through primary school. One twin has had an SNA with her full time. They are just about to head into secondary school and they found out there is a place for one of the twins but potentially not for the other one. They do not know and just have to wait to find out. As the Taoiseach can imagine, that transition is huge anyway, without not even knowing what is happening and potentially being separated, not just for all of her classmates but from her twin. This child has been in school for eight years, the special educational needs organiser has known about it and the fact that there has been no forward planning or preparation for this just blows my mind. I cannot understand how that is not happening. The parents of children who have to fight for their supports in the first instance in primary school should not have to start fighting all over again when they start secondary school. I am asking that polices around planning for students with additional needs are revised. It needs to start before this. Schools should get information from crèches for primary school and then primary school information should be given to secondary schools. There are so many schools in my area that are going above and beyond, fundraising to set up special classes to provide for students in County Kerry. It is not the fault of the schools; the overall system is not accommodating them.

I raised with the Taoiseach previously the case of Jack McNiffe from County Kildare and the issue of July provision. Funding for students in special classes for the summer programme of the July provision had been reduced from €60 per student in 2022 to €45 in 2023 and now to €30 in 2024. The Taoiseach challenged me when I raised the issue before and he questioned the figures. My figures are accurate today; they were accurate then. In fact, the head teachers in primary schools across the State are reporting real stress and difficulty because of these cuts. I put it to the Taoiseach before and I put it to him again that these cuts should be reversed. I do not want him to come back and tell me that the global budget is bigger. I am specifying these particular capitation rates. They are causing a big difficulty. The questions that are being asked relate to child poverty. If we are serious about tackling child poverty and providing for children, particularly those in some cases with very complex needs, then the Government cannot be cutting capitation levels like that, year after year. The Government needs to reverse those decisions as a demonstration of its seriousness in this area of policy.

I have brought up the issue before of children who grew up in chaotic sets of circumstances and the need for early intervention and supports. I have also spoken about the fact that, like many others, I have had to deal with some of these chaotic instances that impact greatly on the wider community and that we do not have the supports of the tools, whether from An Garda Síochána, Tusla, the council or anybody else. I welcome the huge work done at times by the likes of the projects run out of The House in Cox's Demense, the TEAM Project in Muirhevnamor and by Craobh Rua. I could talk about the Louth ABC Changing Lives Initiative or Springboard when it was operated once upon a time with more resources in Muirhevnamor. There were early family supports. That is where we need to go to. Can the Government something that is cross-departmental? We understand this is the responsibility of the Departments of children, Health and Justice. This is from a point of view of looking at the sort of supports we could put in early to have an impact on these children and families and breaking poverty and ensuring children get through to education and jobs and all that is necessary. However, we also need to provide those supports to deal with those communities that are impacted when this all goes wrong and we have not put those supports in.

It is an absolute scandal that more than 4,000 children in this country are homeless. All of those cases are unnecessary or avoidable. I will give a current example of a child who is facing homelessness in an extraordinarily avoidable situation. The child, her father and his partner - the child's mother - live in an apartment in Tallaght. I first met them well over a year ago. They had a notice to quit because the landlord was selling the apartment. They were willing to sell it to the council under the tenant in situ scheme. I contacted the council first with a representation on 29 May. The council said it was pursuing this again and again. This has gone on for more than a year at this stage and then just yesterday, the family got an email from the estate agent saying the local authority had advised they would no longer be proceeding with the sale of the property. The father sent me an email this morning saying that they could not be homeless as their health does not allow them to do so. The father cannot breathe at night without a device, he has heart problems and he is waiting for surgery. His wife is his carer but she is also sick and her daughter is under Jigsaw's care with a mental health issue. He said the county council was slowing everything down for more than one year and at the end of it, they do not seem to care and make people homeless. It is an incredible situation. This has been going on for over a year. It seemed that things were proceeding with the council and now at this last moment, it seems the council is not going ahead.

I have several cases like that as well. There are problems with the tenant in situ scheme and councils are looking for reasons not to go through it with families who are facing the prospect of homelessness. Something has to be done about it.

I want to raise an issue quickly that is also shocking which relates to children with special needs. This story can probably be repeated many times. A young woman and mother called Margaret came in to my office this week. She has two children with special needs. Her son Thomas, who is aged five, was diagnosed with autism an intellectual disability in January 2023. He had been previously referred to the children's disability network team, CDNT, and was waiting on speech and language therapy, occupational therapy and a psychologist. He was due to start the speech and language therapy next week, July 2024, but received a letter last week deferring the appointment until January 2026. I am not easily shocked but that is unbelievable. I know there is the understaffing in the CDNTs and CAMHS, but that is just criminal neglect of a child with special needs. I seriously ask that something be done about that.

I thank Deputy Alan Farrell for raising the school meals programme. This is fundamentally important in tackling child poverty and child hunger but it is also a measure above and beyond that for all parents. It is an assistance in respect of both cost and convenience. People are time poor as well. It is also enables us, because we link it to our healthy eating guidelines, to make sure a child is getting a healthy and nutritious meal too. It has been a great success. We will have an ability to roll it out to all primary schools that wish to have it in 2025. I am struck by the point the Deputy made regarding the schools that wish to have the programme. I intend to probe that a little further now. My understanding was that the take-up had been quite high but let me check that out and also check what feedback there may be from schools on this. I am sure many schools would want to be involved, and I know many schools are involved, but the way it is done is quite helpful to schools and is not a particular burden. I will follow that up because it is important to take the feedback.

I thank Deputy Cairns for raising the issue of special school places. I am not going to dispute this. She is right; there is a need to plan much earlier. This idea that the system is surprised that somebody needs to move from preschool to primary school, primary school to secondary school or even secondary school to third level education is a nonsense. I accept we are not doing enough in this space and we need to do much more and much better. It is one of the areas on which we have a particular focus at the Cabinet committee on disability. We are focusing on how we can start to get ahead of this situation. I can read out notes here that will say that everybody who needs a place will get a place. I believe that to be true but it misses the point in terms of the stress, anxiety and worry that somebody feels, such as the parent of the twins referred to by the Deputy. There are other examples of that. I take the legitimate point and I will come back to her further on that.

Regarding Deputy McDonald's question, I do not want to be argumentative in this regard. Summer provision is something I really believe in. It is something that works and is something I invested a fair amount of time into inquiring about, as I should. The Deputy does not want me to give the figure from the global budget but I have to pick a point. The changes we have made are truthfully on the basis of feedback and engagement we have got regarding those who are delivering the programme. I will inquire as to what the Deputy is saying because I am not dismissing the importance of this. I am not having a row with her and I am not saying her numbers are wrong. I accept there have been changes to the capitation grant but I also know that every single cent moved from there is still within the budget to provide various aspects of the programme.

We had been hearing from the schools of the different supports they needed. We have seen an increase in our schools looking to partake this year compared with last year which is an encouraging sign. I am happy to talk further with the Deputy on this and I am happy to receive any correspondence from her. More people will access July provision this year than last year. More schools are participating this year than last year, which is positive.

I know Deputy Ó Murchú brings up on a regular basis, which is a positive, the need to find more crosscutting ways to address families or children who find themselves in chaos through no fault of theirs and the need not to have a siloed approach. There are some examples of work the Department of children has led on to allow other groups to plug in. I might get the Deputy a note on initiatives we currently have in place. He might come back to me with any gaps he might see on that.

Deputy Paul Murphy, and Deputy Boyd Barrett briefly, spoke about the tenant in situ scheme and the rather upsetting case Deputy Murphy outlined. We introduced the tenant in situ scheme to help ensure the tenant could remain in situ. If that is not being operationalised or there are shortcomings, I would like to follow that up. I will take the example Deputy Murphy has given - Deputy Boyd Barrett has said there are many more like it - talk to the Minister, Deputy Darragh O'Brien, and he or I will come back to the Deputy in writing on it. I also ask him to send me details on speech and language therapy. I accept there are challenges in the system. We are recruiting more. I do not accept a scenario that somebody should be told they had an appointment very shortly and now that appointment is in 2026; that is not acceptable.